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Originally Posted by GJEChamberlain
Osu! Seienchin,
I think there are talented and driven individuals who by nature seek to be the best they can be. These will undoubtedly progress in all aspects of training and become the champions and instructors of the future. There are also those who select their preference and excel in that, so kata champions are not always top fighters etc.
My comments really relate to the type of kata training. I'm not much for martial arts historical debate, but the fighting styles in virtually all arts have moved on in leaps and bounds while the traditional kata have remained fixed. The benefits you describe - athleticism, co-ordination, weight distribution, focus, breath control and a host of other things that actually are also useful in kumite are improved by 'modern' kata too, but perhaps in a way that has a more easy transfer to modern kumite.
Let's not forget that many of the kata seen and practised today as traditional were at one point inducing similar outrage in those that prefered the even older ones. At what point does someone have the clout to say, "OK - enough now. These are the kata and they will now remain the same for ever" and even if they did, wouldn't that limit progress?
Gary
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A bit like modern music. At the time he was composing, Mozart was controversial!!!
I am just struggling to think of a single gifted fighter who looks like a gumby when they try to do kata. I don't think that the kata champions will be kumite champions, or vice versa, but it can sometimes happen, but I just can't think of someone from Australia who has made top 16 at Worlds who was really bad, or even mediocre at kata. I'm not saying that the necessarily beavered away at it..that is not my point. I'm just noticing an interesting convergence.
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Originally Posted by SHIDOKANATLANTA
most fighters don't practice kata. it was rare to find people who are good at both. most karate fighters who kick box or do mma competitively, stop going to class and focus on competing when getting ready for a fight. serious knockdown fighters focus on conditioning and sparring. traditional kihon and kata does not translate to sparring. they'd rather do drills that resemble what they are going to do in sport. being good in kata and being a competitive combat athlete are in no way related. to be good at fighting you have to fight. kata is not live practice for the fighter. you can't learn timing and reaction and you don't get hit.
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I don't agree that we have sufficient evidence base to say "most fighters don't practice kata" - for a start, most of which fighters?
Most kyokushin fighters definitely do practice kata as it is part of their training requirements. However, I've been round the ropes enough times to know what you mean about the differences. Can you think of a fighter who was absolutely hopeless at kata - not someone who didn't care, but someone who, in spite of trying, was an absolute disaster at kata, but lethal in the ring? I just can't!!!!! (I think it also depends on what you define as "good at kata" - for example, I don't much care about the snapping sound of the gi -but I do care that the techniques have power, focus and follow-through.)
Here's another question - what about kata training as active recovery for fighters - to get corked thighs moving again, to rebuild quad strength after injury to knees? After my knee reconstructions, my orthopaedic surgeon told me to forget about physio and just do kata - he said it was like physio for fighters.
Thoughts?