Ashihara question

[Nix]

Higashidani Shihan moved to Århus in 1984. Århus Budo Karate Klub, as it was called at the time, practiced kyokushin (source - though it may have been an offshoot, but I know that the late Sensei Jørn Louring, the founder, had kyokushin experience).

In 1986, they switched to Goju-Ryu, which they practiced for two years, untill the branch chief returned from a practice stay in the Ashihara dojo in Matsuyama, and they switched to Ashihara Karate in 1988, as you correctly point out. The dojo is today named Ashihara Karate Århus.

I did not know that he left Kyokushin that early, I thought he took his leave with the late Kancho Hideyuki Ashihara in 1979, and that he was given the title of Shihan to spread Ashihara around the globe - more specifically Denmark.

[Dobbersky]

Sensei's and Sempai's

Apologies for the delay in responding to the question regards 10 Ashihara based organisations. From information available on the Internet, all listed can claim direct lineage to Ashihara O Sensei. As we in the UK are 'cut off' from the rest of the world. I await your confirmation of whether any of you know of these styles or are members yourselves. Also I am not too sure if some of these organisations are still active or not.

NIKO
Ashihara Karate UK
Seido Kaikan
Enshin Kaikan
Zen Nihon Budo Karate
Asahi International Karate
Ashihara Karate International
Ashihara Budokai
Kenka Karate
Shin Taii Kudo
Chusinkai
Tsu Shin Gen
GoshinKaiKan

Finally I am sure that some of you have mentioned organisations not actually on this list.

I wonder if Ashihara O Sensei is proud of where his style, Ashihara Karate, has influenced so many to make it part of their lives.


Osu

[Martin H]

Actually, I tought the 10 ashihara organizations was organizations teaching ashihara karate, not ashihara offshots like enshin. You know, Niko, Ashihara internationa, international ashihara etc etc.
Otherwise it would be like listing ashihara as a kyokushin organization. Or kyokushin as a goju ryu organization.

[Spirit]

Originally Posted by Martin H

Actually, I thought the 10 ashihara organizations was organizations teaching ashihara karate, not ashihara offshoots like enshin. You know, Niko, Ashihara international, international ashihara etc etc.
Otherwise it would be like listing ashihara as a Kyokushin organization. Or Kyokushin as a goju ryu organization.

Excellent point Martin...

Wouldn't Seido kaikan be offshoot from Seido???

Tsu Shin Gen, though Shihan Cook uses many sabaki techniques and was once part of the group, I really can't see it being grouped in as one of its offshoot.
I'll have to e-mail him and ask him his opinion on this one.

[Groucho]

Originally Posted by jap man

Wouldn't Seido kaikan be offshoot from Seido???

No, Ishii went from Kyokushin to study with Ashihara, then left after a matter of months (IIRC) to found Seido-Kaikan

And consideriing the vast difference in philosophy regarding contact, I personally find it odd the two groups share such similar names...

[Spirit]

Thank you for the answer

[jolut]

Tsu Shin Gen web site
Tsu Shin Gen International

[Nix]

I myself am a student in NIKO, and I know of Ashihara International (and some of the offshoots, like Enshin). I also know that Ashihara UK are independent from NIKO, but I've seen that practicioners from for instance Scotland has entered the early Sabaki Challenge Spirit tournaments. So, when did you guys leave NIKO? Or are there, or have there been, any NIKO dojo in the UK?

Also, since the list contains offshoots instead of actual Ashihara based organisations, how many are we down to? Just 3 or 4, no?

[Azimuth]

NIKO
AKI
AIKO
SABAKI-DO
UK ASHIHARA International ( independent)
Turkish Ashihara Budokai ( also independent )

So that makes 6 organisations that still practise ashihara without the offshoots taken in account .

Osu

[Martin H]

Originally Posted by jolut

Ashihara International with Narker in SA
Ashihara International with Dave jonkers, David Cook in Holland (not same as narkers org.)

Im pretty sure that Narkers organisation is called Ashihara karate international (AKI?).
The Organisation - Ashihara Karate International - Kaicho Hoosain Narker Sabaki Fighting Karate

Jonkers organization is called Ashihara international karate (AIK?)
no link to this one that I know of, but here is a page from sem schildts website: Ashihara International :
And he is a member and direct student to Jonkers, so he should know.

I used to seriously confuse these groups, and looked them up a while go.

[Satori]

Originally Posted by Groucho

And consideriing the vast difference in philosophy regarding contact, I personally find it odd the two groups share such similar names...

I heard that Seido Juku went to court over the name and won (against Seido Kaikan). From memory this was sometime last year, but I don't have any sources to back it up, and I don't know what, if any, implications this has.

[Nix]

Originally Posted by Martin H

Im pretty sure that Narkers organisation is called Ashihara karate international (AKI?).
(snip-snip)
Jonkers organization is called Ashihara international karate (AIK?)

According to this page, which I found on Narker's AKI site, there are ten styles/organisations that evolvedfrom Kancho Ashihara's teachings, two of which bear the Ashihara name: NIKO and his own AKI. David Cook and David Jonkers are under the same style, Ashihara Budokai.

Can it be assumed that the information on the AKI page is incorrect, or that Jonker established another organisation, AIKO?

[jolut]

More info
Ashihara kaikan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[jolut]

If you read polish more info :

ASHIHARA INTERNATIONAL KARATE ORGANISATION - Oddzia³ Polska

[Azimuth]

Originally Posted by LoQi

.
Can it be assumed that the information on the AKI page is incorrect, or that Jonker established another organization, AIKO?

The Organization is called AIKO but there is strong cooperation with the IBK and thats where the Budokai comes from .
unfortunately only mentioned in (mostly) dutch Ashihara sites .

[Dobbersky]

Sensei's and Sempai's

I have a respectful question regards all the different Ashihara Organisations around the world.

I have spent many years training with blood, sweat and a couple of tears to be worthy of my blackbelt. If I emigrated to say USA, New Zealand or Australia, would the local Ashihara Dojo of a different Organisation recognise my shodanship or would I have to regrade either as shodan or begin from white belt?

PM me if you don't wish your comments/views to be shown on the tread


Osu

[vapor]

Dobbersky.

You have asked a very good question, and one that should be asked/ discussed in an open way

Obviously, none of us are in the position to say anything with authority, just speculation and personal opinion, so weigh that against anything that is stated.

vapor

[Shokei Marcsui]

That should be decided by the head of the particular organization or the Sensei of the dojo. Perhaps an assessment should be given?

[Nix]

Yeah, what Shokei Marcsui said. Ask the branch chief of the respective dojo.

I believe it also has something to do with the actual obi, since the black belts are different for the various styles - and I don't think you can just order a new belt; you have to have a certificate.

Recently, a dojo here in Denmark converted to Ashihara Karate, and the branch chief was then given a shodan degree.

Also, as vapor has already pointed out, I really don't know anything, this is just assumptions and hypotheses.

[ksan]

Originally Posted by LoQi

Recently, a dojo here in Denmark converted to Ashihara Karate, and the branch chief was then given a shodan degree.

Was he already a yudansha ? If so was he higher graded outside of ashihara and did he convert from a kyokushin (or offshoot) to ashihara?

Back on topic:
An introduction letter from your current branchchief or Dojo operator to the new Branch Chief or the new Dojo operator might be good. In Holland the ashihara and kyokushin grades are quite interchangable (we train together and recognise the other grades when training)

Osu