retraining old instincts

[blackshield]

Hi everyone, this is my first post here.

I recently started Kyokushin after having studied a variety of arts over the last 8 years or so - mostly Goju Ryu. I started Kyokushin because I moved and the Goju cubs that I have tried since are not my cup of tea - I was used to hard full contact sparring in Goju, and all the goju clubs here seem to be No-Contact! Wierd! Anyway, I knew a few guys in my old club that had come from Kyokushin backgrounds (some were very high level competitors) and they told me I should try it.

The main thing I am finding difficult is suppressing my instinct to grab - for throws and strikes and sweeps etc... In Goju we did a lot of grabs/throws/locks/sweeps etc, and whilst the striking is still in the same style the my menatlity and tactics are thrown off! eg when someone throws a mid level round kick i want to wrap up the leg and take out the standing leg. Or if I am up against a very good fast kicker - I want to smoother him, get in tight and clinch for knees/elbows and a throw.

Don't get me wrong - I am loving Kyokushin! but what I wanted to ask was a) has anyone else had problems retraining these kind of 'old instincts' and b) do people wounder whether the rule set limits your ability to counter an opponents fighting style (eg - if a guy is a better striker i would take him down/lock him up - but in kyokushin I have to go 'like 4 like' - which seems to give me less tactical options)

[vapor]

Thanks for posting! Welcome!

You have posed some good questions.
I am sure that there are more than a few here who have been in the same situation as you, and will share their thoughts!

vapor

[Bloke]

Welcome to the forums Blackshield.

Back in the early nineties a one second grab rule was introduced in the some tournaments. This suited us very well as we had a nasty habit of grabbing anyway and were always getting warned for it. Turned out people who were good at the grabbing could really use it to their advantage over those that werent and there were KOs a plenty.

As a result of this the rule weas rescinded and no grabbing allowed. Now everyone who had learnt it had to unlearn it and over time they did. So that should answer the a) part of your question I hope.

The answer to b) is simply this - any rule set is limiting (unless the rule is there are no rules). I have sparred with TKD people and not being able to kick a low kick, which is bread and butter for Kyokushin people, was really hard.

I hope this helps.

[Spirit]

Unless your in a tourney, it should not matter how you spar in the dojo??? unless rules of what and what not be used are stated..
Of course the safety issue is always at hand, but I would think nikyu and up you could use all the differnt tech's you know.

This will depend on instructor (major factor if he/she is not comfortable with the tech's you use and also don't know them or understands them it hurts their rep as a instructor), other students (who complain) and your ability to do all the tech's without bodly (undue) harm i.e. un safe throws or uncontrolable etc...

I would talk with the instructor on this issue, if it is a answer your not happy with find another dojo Kyokushin or other. No need to be controlled like that and be unhappy.
One should always train where knowledge is constant and resriction is at a minimal , stay only if you are learning and happy.

[Bruce]

I spent many years doing a different style of karate and found it extremely difficult to retrain my body to instinctively perform all techniques in a slightly different manner. Even now after 4 years I have to remind myself to move in stances or katas in the correct way, although this thought/body reaction time is now down to fractions of a second it still annoys me! I'm the opposite to you though in that we had a very restricted set of techniques that we used to spar with and I was like a kid in a sweetshop when I started kyokyshin and I found out I could drop an axe kick on someones nose....how much fun is that!!!

[Bloke]

Bruce the answer is a lot. Its a lot of fun.

Unless of course you own the nose in question

[Bruce]

And unfortunately I 'nose' all about it. ahem. perhaps that should have been under the joke of the day thread. I found that getting a controlled axe kick in the face to be rather motivating as It made me aspire to the same level of skill and control....not there yet though. I've just realised that anyone from my dojo could b reading this and I'll probably come under a sustained series of these kicks for the forseeable future!

[blackshield]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for all your responses - some great food for thought in there. Interesting about the one-second grab rule, and how it resulted in the KO's you mentioned. Kind of summed up the way I was thinking, in that people who can utilize varied tactics, against those that can't will generally do well. Is this the route that the Ashihara/Enshin guys went down?

Interesting as well that one of you mentioned sparring however you like in class... the class I have joined spar very much as 'tournament rules' in class - so no grabbing. I see what you mean as far as finding somewhere that suites me - but whilst I am here I am not opposed to sparring/fighting in the tourny way - The way I figure - it gives me chance to improve my striking game, by not allowing myself to 'revert to type' as far as my usual sparring style.

Perhaps in time I will need to find another club that will allow a more varied framework on top of the kyokushin, so I can put back in my previous training (with the skills I learn in Kyokushin).

[Spirit]

I think that being a balanced fighter out weighs tourny rules...
OK what I should have said is, sparring should be very open to interitaion and use all skills taught in each style, graps and throws are part of Kyokushin EVEN IF they are not part of the tourny rules...
I let all fighting TOOLS to be used in the dojo at all times, when you fight in tourny, then you adjust. I believe this type of sparring make you a more balanced and validates you as a fighter.