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Osu!

After Hasbeen collared me I was keen to return the favour! We all appreciate his posts, and having met him at K2 this year I can say it's a real pleasure to post his training stories. Although not training at the moment he is still extremely keen and knowledgeable about karate. He's been there and done it in a club that I know had some very hard fighters.

PART 1

GC) When did you start training in karate?

I’m not sure of the exact year but it was the late 70`s.

GC) And where?

In Dickie Dowler’s Surrey Karate Kyokushinkai. The main dojo`s were in the Croydon area but they also stretched into Surrey which made it a perfect situation for the student, you could train most nights if you wished and you could pick who you wanted to train under!

GC) Who was your first instructor?

Dickie Dowler, one of the funniest people I have ever met, he could have been anything he wanted, he was that intelligent. During every session when we were getting our breath back, he would pick on one of the higher grades and just take the p*** out of them... much to everybody’s amusement! He was very highly respected, at the time a 4th Dan Kyokushin, Chairman of the BKK, highly ranked in judo and I believe aikido.

GC) Please give the modern karate-ka an impression of 70's style training.

Training in the 70`s was hard and brutal, nobody cared about you as an individual, if you could handle it and you enjoyed it you stayed, if not goodbye!

Some of the shodan’s and higher grades at the time took great pleasure in knocking a big beginner about but I wouldn’t say all, some were more than helpful, or perhaps just nice and it didn’t take me long to find out who was who.

As a low grade it used to give me perverse pleasure when Bernard turned up unexpectedly and lined up everybody shodan and above and (including 3rd dans) and kick the s*** out of them, you knew Bernard had turned up because the whole place just went silent, I promise this is not an exaggeration!

I went to Exeter University for a summer camp and at 17 stone I found the 10 mile run hard, I stopped to get my breath and got chased up the hill with somebody brandishing a shinai...the good old days hey!?

A couple of days later I was in the Uni-bar with Terry, a paraplegic who trained in a wheel chair and a few of our group... We had a few too many, nobody even considered the night training! I’ll leave the rest to your imagination!

GC) Was it easy for you going through the grades?

No quite the opposite, my hips felt like they were made of cement, I had no trouble with straight kicks and uchi mawashi but I struggled with mawashi geri, I also struggled with kata, everybody went one way and I went another.... I had to train more often than most people to make progress!

GC) Did you cross train at all?

Bit of a story behind this one! I worked in an environment where nobody wore a tie, then all of a sudden I had to, so in protest I wore a big silver bow tie. Later that evening a fellow asked who the big p**** was, I said my names **** and I think this p**** could sort you out! It turned out he was Boy George’s minder and he invited me to "train" with him and his colleague, a semi pro heavyweight boxer... I said OK and turned up at their gym the next day.

After a few exercises they put boxing gloves on me and said I could fight the minder.... I dropped him with a mae geri to the stomach and did something similar to the other guy who is now one of my best friends... They taught me to box and I taught them to kick.

GC) I know Bernard Creton was one of your influences. Please tell us about him.

Bernard was a nice enough guy out of a gi but in a gi a monster. (Edit: You're being kind! GC)
You just couldn’t win, if you went through the motions with him he would clobber you, if you hurt him he would really clobber you... The secret was to avoid him in the line up! Bad enough for three minutes but if he wanted the sparring to go on for ten minutes who was going to argue with him!?

I’ve seen him knock a third dan senseless and pick the guy up by the belt and carry on doing it... I won’t name him out of respect.

One story Bernard told me I quite like is his trip to Qatar.
Bernard had a friend who was a tennis pro in Oman and he invited Bernard over for a holiday. Me, “Did you do any training over there?” "Yes, I did some training with the kings (or some high ranking guy - I can’t remember exactly who) body guards” “How did it go?” I asked, "Well after I knocked the instructor down for the third time they thought it would be a good idea to let me teach!"

I believe he was offered clubs there but I’m not too sure what happened about that.

The only time I was ever so slightly cheeky to him was when Jeff Whybrow beat him in the final of the British Open, I asked him the following Friday how his ribs were…

Bernard and Jeff used to take turns teaching on the Fridays. Many more stories, the best thing to do is get me over a pint and I’ll bore the pants of you!!

GC) You were lucky enough to train under Sensei Nakamura when he first came over to the UK. Please give us your impressions.

I liked Sensei Nakamura, he took the time to try and help everybody, I remember him standing next to me and saying," Make strong, Make strong!" What struck me about him was his balance and how technically good he was. He also brought a few training methods over with him that none of us had seen before, in a nutshell it was an honour to train under him, he was very highly respected!

GC) Did your working career help, or hinder your karate?

At the time I got sickpay so I suppose if anything it helped, especially with regard to injuries!

GC) At what grade did you start competing?

At blue belt level with wuko and clicker type rules.

GC) How did it go?

I never got beaten fair and square (IMO)

I got disqualified twice!! and I won one "Surrey" representative fight - knockdown.

I was forbidden to enter any competitions because I would not squad train every weekend.

I fought many of the big names of the time sparring and managed to embarrass quiet a few of them!

I attended a knockdown training session with Bob Bolton and listened for a few minutes to him telling this other guy the best way to knock me down, he never even spoke to me! So after agreeing to knockdown rules I knocked the guy sparko! Again no word to me, just to the other guy, "You might as well not bother entering!"

PART 2

GC) How long did you train for, and why did you stop?

Eight years with an injury break in between.

I stopped because of injury. I had also had enough of all the restrictions put on me and Adrian Clamp. One of my instructors told me I was good enough to enter the British Open and perhaps do OK. Adrian had groomed me for a long time and I told him I wanted to enter the British Open with my current licence without telling anybody and then resign afterwards. Dickie and Bernard had now broken away and formed British Karate Jutsu Remnei which made everything more complicated. I would have stayed with the BKK but I remembered a grading which a few of us took wearing the Surrey badge of Dickie and we all failed. The guy going for the same grade as me, lined up next to me ended up a very high grade in at least three other styles of MA and won a BKK wuko competition but HE wasn’t considered good enough because of the ongoing p*******. This really put me out, that people could train hard and be knocked back on a whim!

So I thought “F*** em all!” Custers last stand and if I do alright perhaps I could rejoin the BKK.

I trained for months. Road running, which I hate. Weights (never believed in them but I did it) and hired the martial arts centre privately in Sutton for a Saturday night. There were about ten club members who wanted to spar knockdown and I would help them with my limited teaching abilities, so I got to fight full on with ten people every weekend as part of my build up, not including the other training sessions.

All went well until I was showing somebody how to deal with somebody kneeing you - I told him he should do it as if he meant it, he was just too "namby pamby" and the of course the inevitable happened - left knee facing backwards, snapped this, broken that, dislocated that... End of and goodnight from me.

Goodbye fitness, I couldn’t walk normally for about three years... Hello pub and blubber!!

GC) Ouch! Did you get any other bad injuries?

A broken hand! I hit Adrian on the point of his elbow, broken wrist bones three times, broken ribs and got turned onto my head. I got my head out of the way and got a bad shoulder injury. All these plus the ‘normal’ kyokushin injuries!!

GC) What is your best training memory?

My best training memory and it still makes me laugh was Dickie Dowler again!

He was teaching somewhere as a guest instructor and asked if anybody fancied travelling there, so me and a mate of mine went along.

The session went as normal and then he asked us all to put the pads on and went into his p*** taking routine.

"You see that monster over there, you lot had better pray he is in a good mood because from what I have seen from you lot so far, if he so much as farts you lot will go down! Be nice to him, very, very nice if you want to go home in one piece.... now I didn’t know what to do out of embarrassment and my mate was in hysterics!!

GC) And the worst?

The p******* and the sheer greed of people, believe me when the "p" word rears it’s ugly head it is normally down to dosh, not what is good for the student!!

GC) Ah the dreaded 'P' word. Religion and politics have no place in the dojo in my opinion! If you could do it all again, what would you have changed?

In my area at the time there were loads of BKK dojo’s including Hanshi’s. What I should have done is flit between them all and not develop any sense of loyalty to any particular person and let my karate training do the talking.

Plus I knocked somebody down at a wuko competition deliberately after not getting an ippon, that still haunts me!

GC) What advice would you give to anybody considering taking up karate?

Take your time and don’t start training five times a week if you get the bug! Twice is more than enough to start with. Pick your dojo well, attend a few sessions and see how the higher grades react to beginners. Ask advice about styles and instructors from those in the know and check what insurance the dojo has or has not. Be aware that those wearing a black belt are not supermen; they are just normal people who have achieved something you can achieve, if you put in the same amount of time and dedication.

More importantly....ENJOY!!

GC) What advice would you give to instructors?

Please look at your students as individuals with individual talents and needs that need to be nurtured in different ways! Not thirty people here for army square-bashing!!

Talk and communicate to your students and find out what they want out of karate. And most of all remember humility and respect works both ways!!

GC) I know you are a popular and well respected contributor to K4L. Any messages?

Yes, I just want to say what a pleasure it is to be a member among people I respect. K4L is full of talented international karateka, long may it remain so.....

GC) What are your future plans?

To get my right hip resurfaced and work out how somebody who’s body is falling apart can get a little bit fit and for those that have seen me a little less fat!

I hope nothing I have said has upset anybody, or I have appeared "too big for my boots!"

Thank you for your time Gary and a big OSU!!! TO EVERYBODY!!!!!!!!!!!!!

lets hope this has started the ball rolling, I have embarrassed myself........WHO IS NEXT?

GC) Thanks mate!

[jcc]

Osu!

Thanks for that one. Good to hear about 'the good old days'!

Osu!

[MilkManX]

Another good one.

Man you guys sure had it rough! I believe that my Sensei is everything that Hasbeen says they should be.

He was there back in the day too and doesnt remember it very fondly at all.

Good training to you Hasbeen when you get fixed up!

[KvW]

Osu!

Thanks guys. These interviews make really interesting reading.

[vapor]

Great read!! I can just envision the two of you with your notepads out....knocking down pints and asking each other questions!

vapor

[ksan]

Good one.... keep them coming guys... always good to read karate stories

Osu

(forum says i cant give you anymore rep, so i gave it to hasbeen in the other thread

[Dent]

Osu!

Another excellent read! Thank you both! (And I have to spread that rep around before hand you anymore. )

Osu!

[senshido]

Excellent Guys... Osu

[sandman]

Osu! Thanks guys!

[walshy]

Osu, really enjoyed that!!

[Bloke]

Excellent stuff - thank you both.

[bathala]

I was a bit taken-a-back with

All these plus the ‘normal’ kyokushin injuries!!

.

Should I be concerned? I'm 35 with a lot of motorcycle related injuries and just starting out with kyokushin.

[Nix]

Originally Posted by bathala

Should I be concerned?

In the ten years I've been around, I've only seen one serious injury. The usual injuries are things like sprained fingers and toes, and if you're really unlucky, broken fingers, toes, knuckles and ribs. These are the most common injuries. Personally, I've never broken anything, and I've never had an injury that put me out of practice for more than a day. Then there is the wear injuries if you are not careful (doing a lot of bunnyjumps will bust your knees for example). You can also expect lots of bruises, and in the start, aching forearms and shins untill you get the conditioning and proper technique in place.

A shocking revelation to outsiders, is that karate (and martial arts in general) is actually much safer than football, handball and most other common sports. Not only are there more accidents, but they are generally more serious. This is statistically proven (I may be able to find the ressources, but they will be in Danish).

[Lucy]

Another nice interview. Well done guys. It's good to hear old stories like these

[tmd]

Thanks guys, been up since 4 and just got to the hotel, thought I'd better check my emails an and saw this - and hey just had to read. Thanks Hasbeen insightful as ever.

[sandman]

Originally Posted by bathala

I was a bit taken-a-back with .

Should I be concerned? I'm 35 with a lot of motorcycle related injuries and just starting out with kyokushin.

Originally Posted by Nix

In the ten years I've been around, I've only seen one serious injury. The usual injuries are things like sprained fingers and toes, and if you're really unlucky, broken fingers, toes, knuckles and ribs. These are the most common injuries. Personally, I've never broken anything, and I've never had an injury that put me out of practice for more than a day. Then there is the wear injuries if you are not careful (doing a lot of bunnyjumps will bust your knees for example). You can also expect lots of bruises, and in the start, aching forearms and shins untill you get the conditioning and proper technique in place.

A shocking revelation to outsiders, is that karate (and martial arts in general) is actually much safer than football, handball and most other common sports. Not only are there more accidents, but they are generally more serious. This is statistically proven (I may be able to find the ressources, but they will be in Danish).

Osu!

Nix is right - the "normal" injuries are minor things. Bumps, bruises, jammed fingers, etc..., and the occasional broken fingers or ribs. Nothing that requires anything more than ice, heat, bandages, aspirin, rest, or some combination of those.

[bathala]

Hmmm. I am a bit weary of small injuries. Considering that insurance is almost non-existent in my country. Like when I was bitten by my cat last February, my health insurance still haven't reimbursed me with the 150USD that I shelled-out for the rabies shots.

I also checked my health care provider and it seems that karate training related injuries are under the "self-inflicted" and hence not covered. Its a good thing that motorcycle related injuries are covered because its under "vehicular accidents".

Still, I did speak to my sensei and subtly hinted that I would like to concentrate on learning kata's and would try to avoid kumite's if possible. I do hope he gets it though.

Still, I am off-topic, I would say that the interview with Hasbeen is an eye-opener for me ... to say the least. Great interview!

[Nix]

Originally Posted by bathala

I also checked my health care provider and it seems that karate training related injuries are under the "self-inflicted" and hence not covered.

What if you "tripped and fell" on your way to practice?

[Dent]

Osu!

Originally Posted by Nix

What if you "tripped and fell" on your way to practice?

I've used that one!

Osu!